oh, man

[serene]

Not posted in the person's journal whose entry inspired it, but it's no
secret I feel this way, so I'm not locking it:

If your reaction to being ill, and having your medication give you the
side effect of no appetite, is to be happy you're losing weight, *and to
hope it continues*, there is something wrong. This is not healthy. This
is not good.

*sigh*

Comments

[twostepsfwd.livejournal.com]

I've had that happen to me. If you're an overeater without any internal mechanism that tells you when you're full, it can be a little bit of a blesing to be honest... But only within reason... Because if you really have NO appetite and aren't eating enough, or are too nauseous to keep food down ... Um, HELLO! WTF?! This is a problem, indeed.

This reminds me of when I first got sick a few yrs ago and couldn't eat anything and therefore lost about 25 lbs and everyone told me HOW GREAT I LOOK. I wanted to wack them.

Being sick sucks. Medication side effects suck.

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

I have an online friend who has people tell her that all the time. Imagine the looks on their faces when she says "Thanks! I have terminal cancer!"

(I <heart> my friends.)

[twostepsfwd.livejournal.com]

I love it. I said shit to people, too, like "What, so you're saying I didn't look good before?" or "Thanks, I can't keep any food down."

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Yeah. My response to people asking me how I lost a hundred pounds is, "I got divorced. Hard to eat when you're crying all the time."

[twostepsfwd.livejournal.com]

Oh man, that is depressing. I'd love to see the look on their faces.

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

They usually look chastised, but I'm not doing it to make them feel bad, in the end. I'm doing it to challenge their notion that weight loss is always a good and healthy thing, or that people who get thinner are that way because they're morally superior or something.

Cute-poet-chick (my ex-wife) lost a lot of weight around the same time, but it was because she got diagnosed with an illness. I sometimes wonder if she gets the same shit.

[ailbhe]

I used to say "I call it the 'dangerously underweight through overwork' diet." Or sometimes "I got this thin by doing your job while you skive off. Try it."

Because at the point when most people congratulated me on my slender, willowlike appearance, I weighed over 15% less than I should have done. People are fucked up.

[krasota.livejournal.com]

damn skippy!

What's more infuriating is having a pretty serious past with disordered eating, confiding in one's doctor that this side effect is not suitable (and in fact, downright dangerous), and having doctor say, "well, you can stand to lose a few pounds."

Thank god my GP said, "WHAT? That is NOT okay? I don't care if you're overweight, medication-induced anorexia is NOT cool." He's a good man.

[twostepsfwd.livejournal.com]

UGH! That is so NOT okay. Fuckin' fuckheads.

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Ohmifuckinggod. What an asshole.

Well....

[dakiwiboid.livejournal.com]

I DID lose 50 pounds when my appetite was suppressed by a medication. I managed to get myself into healthier eating habits, and now I'm down to my target weight. It took several years, mind you, but it was started by having my appetite suppressed by a medication for six to eight months. It's not always bad.

Re: Well....

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

It's a harmful side effect. That you made the best of it is fine. You could have, however, taken on healthy eating habits without putting your body through something harmful. Hell, you could have taken on healthy eating habits, stayed fat, and still been more healthy than you were before. My point is that when it's seen as a good thing, you're really not doing anyone any good. Wasting away is bad for your body. Losing fifty pounds in six months is generally bad for your body. I'm glad you feel you've benefitted, but I'm not convinced that being at your "target weight" is evidence that you're healthier than you were before, especially since it began with an alarmingly fast loss of weight, which is something doctors are supposed to look out for as a sign that something's wrong. As noted in several comments on this thread, though, many doctors ignore the sign that something's wrong and *congratulate the patient for the bad side effect*. The world is fucked sometimes, I think.

I feel better in many ways, however

[dakiwiboid.livejournal.com]

When I was fatter, my acid reflux was a whole lot worse. I had a lot more attacks. I also had a lot more trouble with my asthma, which has been shown to be connected to the acid reflux. I had to be put on steroids several times a year to control my asthma, in fact, and that's no longer the case.

That's not really an alarmingly high loss of weight, considering that it's less than 10 pounds a month. Lots of people lose a couple of pounds per week when they're dieting, Serene. I was eating a lot of veggies while I was losing the weight, since that's what I was in the mood for. My husband works in the medical profession, and he says that it wasn't an unreasonable rate of weight loss at all, especially since I was walking daily.

The weight I'd gained went on through unhealthy eating. I don't think that I would have had the impetus to lose it without losing my appetite. I lost my craving for the junk food I had been eating and starting thinking seriously about what I was putting in my body. That's what made the difference. I'm glad it happened.

I don't think too many doctors would look at a patient who is having fewer acid reflux attacks, less trouble with her asthma and fewer migraines and say that she's less healthy.

Re: I feel better in many ways, however

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Nor did I say you're less healthy. I said that the simple fact that you lost weight doesn't automatically say you're less healthy, though lots of people would say it does.

Regardless, I'm happy you feel better now, I truly am.

Re: Well....

[pir-anha.livejournal.com]

lucky for you that you had an extra 50 lbs to lose. what if you hadn't had them?

yes, an unintended side effect is always a bad thing, because something is out of whack, out of control. that you happened to manage it well, and in effect could make lemonade from lemons is pure luck. it says, however, nothing good about that medication.

i lost a lot of weight during chemo. i hope you can see how ridiculous it would be if i said "see, cancer isn't always bad".

Re: Well....

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

You have this way, fish, of saying what I want to say, but doing it with more concision than I can manage even on a good day. Thanks!

Re: Well....

[sebab.livejournal.com]

I'm another person who lost unnecessary weight through illness, but the whole experience did lead me me to eat less junk food and start exercising regularly, so it wasn't all bad,

Though the "you look great NOW" comments when all I wanted to do was eat AND COULD NOT were really rage-inducing... I wish people wouldn't focus on weight so much.

I never looked at the weight loss as a blessing so much as a 'bright side' of not feeling well. Especially since almost all of my weight gain is around my middle, which is not only unesthetic but also unhealthy.

But again, I had the weight to lose... have been in the situation (like now) where I have relatively little buffer against such things... lack of appetite is extra-dangerous.

Re: Well....

[sebab.livejournal.com]

Er, I mean I lost weight that was unhealthy for me to be carrying, but not through conscious effort... not "unnecessary weight." Sigh.

Re: Well....

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Just as a datapoint, fat around the middle is not unaesthetic to me, nor to many of the people I know.

Re: Well....

[sebab.livejournal.com]

I never gain much weight in the chest area, so it looks weird and unfeminine to me, like I cry when oassing by a mirror etc.

Relatedly, currently having a lot of emotional trouble with the bulgy abdomen resulting from transplant, though not as much trouble because it's easier to hide and doesn't (at least!) indicate lack of health (whta tlittle health I can cling to these days, anyway)

Having been very thin and pretty heavy, I do notice most people treat me more nicely on average when I'm not heavy... some of the distress is based on that. Easy to say I shouldn't be around such people, but harder to implement in RL, as so many folks do realize.

It's no wonder it's a sensitive subject for just about everyone :(

In that case

[dakiwiboid.livejournal.com]

My neurologist would have put me on a different medication to begin with. We discussed the possible side effects before I started taking it, and since I was overweight, and did want to lose a nice chunk, I was perfectly happy to learn that appetite supression was a possible side effect. I was also very, very happy to stop having migraines daily, which was the main point of taking the medication, just as not having cancer was the main point of having chemo was for you, wasn't it.

I'm complained about this before, but...

[hfnuala.livejournal.com]

I am horrified by how many people congratulated me on having lost weight while pregnant, a time when it is actively dangerous to do so. As it happens, there have been no ill affects, but it was a source of worry for me, not something I wanted people to praise me for.

Re: I'm complained about this before, but...

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Right, exactly! There is a tendency today to claim that concern about body size and weight is about wanting people to be healthier, but I see lots of evidence that for a lot of people, that's not it at all.

Re: I'm complained about this before, but...

[ailbhe]

A buh boo buh buh WHAT?!

No words. Ugh. So sorry.

Re: I'm complained about this before, but...

[patgreene.livejournal.com]

Um, yeah. I lost weight while pregnant, too, mainly by vomiting all the freaking time. And losing the weight was bad news.

[kalmn.livejournal.com]

i am about to go into the doctor and tell her we need to talk about b/c methods because i think the last time i was on the pill it made me gain weight, and i am not willing to do that again. (stay where i am, yes. gain weight due to meds, no.) but i feel weirdly guilty about it.

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Sudden weight gain is as bad for the body as sudden weight loss. I don't want my hormones to go crazy, no matter what it is they make my body do as a result.

[starsail.livejournal.com]

Just curious, was it my post?

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

Yes, and the reasons I posted it here rather than in your post are: (a) because your journal is about you, and I don't want to be (or even seem) unsupportive in your journal; and (b) it's not just you I've seen this from -- your post is just the one that made me think about it right now and want to post it.

[starsail.livejournal.com]

No problem, I figured it was. You are one of those people I admire. From what I read you are comfortable in who you are and seem a beautiful person, inside and out. I've not been comfortable in my skin for many years. And I don't take health problems lightly. I have many. It just feels to me while I have focused for years on food, the more I tried to eat sensibly, the farther in the other direction I go. So for me not to crave carbs/sugar/lots of dairy is a blessing in disguise. I know the lack of appetite can be a symptom of a potentially serious problem. And once I'm over this respiratory problem we will be looking into it. But for now, it is a good thing, for me.

[serenejournal.livejournal.com]

I'm always glad when people get a chance to rest from hurting themselves. That may sound like a weird thing to say, considering this thread, but I really am glad for you, that you've had a chance to examine this stuff. I just really worry about the longterm health effects. I'm glad you're keeping an eye on it.

And thank you SO much for your kind words. I do appreciate them, a lot.

[juliansinger.livejournal.com]

Boy howdy, yes.

Also, good discussion in here. Thanks.

[kiya]

I'm currently being one of the major supports for a friend who's trying to support her girlfriend through a major anorexic period (as in 'if she loses five more pounds she'll never dance again, her heart is developing irregularities' major). Gods. (Said girlfriend is going away for a semester and will thus be away from her support network. We're all hoping for the best while being wickedly anxious.)

I've been on and off trying to gain weight, though I've hit my goal for the moment so I'm not stressed about it. I suspect that my natural weight will reset somewhat up from where it is when I have children; my mother's did. It'll be something of a relief, honestly.

At the same time, I'm trying to support a partner in his weight-loss attempts -- he has good health reasons for wanting to lose the twenty pounds he wants to lose, related to his family medical history. I just wish that the occasional shoals of self-hatred weren't there, because it breaks my heart (and occasionally makes me want to hike up to New Hampshire and punch his mother in the nose).

[hopeforyou.livejournal.com]

I've gotten that too, and wrote about it a while ago. People were telling me how good I looked and that I lost weight, and I said, "thanks, but I didn't lose it the way I wanted to... I got an ulcer".
Then they didn't know what to say.

I'm fine with being told I look great, am beautiful, am sexy, etc. I don't really like the 'you lost weight' being tacked on to it.

[johnpalmer.livejournal.com]

Herm. Since you say "no appetite", if you mean "in fact, eating is just a chore you can easily forget about", then, yes, I agree. And if it's mild nausea (or worse), or heartburn/reflux, or something like that, I defniitely agree.

But I recognize three reasons for what I could (but don't) call my appetite.

They are a need for food, a desire for a pleasant stimulus, and something else.

That "something else" can sometimes get me to eat, even when I know I will be physically uncomfortable afterwards, and even if the food is not pleasant, or even unpleasant.

I wouldn't describe a medication that eliminated the third reason for eating as something that causes me to lose my appetite, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone else called it a loss of appetite.

Depending on the drug, I don't know if it'd be a positive or negative side effect. If it was an antidepressant, I'd consider it a positive side effect; I think of this type of eating as akin to an addiction.

Hm. I'm not sure if I should be talking about this, because I realize what I'm doing here is trying to find an exception to a general rule... and I do agree with the general rule. Is it noodling or nitpicking? I suppose it depends on how you feel about it.

[patgreene.livejournal.com]

I've been very frustrated because I've been gaining weight -- a lot -- since I went on meds for migraine six months ago. This particular drug usually causes people to lose weight, but I often have atypical reactions to drugs. Thing is, the drug works -- it has done a pretty good job of keeping the migraines in check: rather than 1-2 a week, I have 1-2 a month. And they are not anywhere as debilitating.

So I'll keep taking the meds, and trying to find an answer to the weight issue.